Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 1 Num. 45

("Quid coniuratio est?)

[From an interview with the former marketing director of the Arkansas Development and Finance Authority, and former associate of Bill Clinton, Larry Nichols. This interview took place on the May 5, 1994 "America's Town Forum" radio show, hosted by Tom Donahue. The show is broadcast most weekday evenings at 7 pm (cst) on shortwave frequency 5.810 mHz. (Nichols speaks via telephone with Donahue.)]


TOM DONAHUE: Patriotism in action, Tom Donahue, "America's Town Forum." So glad you could join us on our, uh "town hall" today.

Let me just tell you what's coming up tomorrow and Monday: Gary Parks will be with us. He's the son of the slain Jerry Parks, who provided security detail for Bill Clinton during his Presidential campaign. And John Hillier(?) will be with us Monday.

So "Clinton-gate," 3 power-packed days. And today is no exception. Larry Nichols, our return guest. Larry worked for Bill Clinton at one time. He was the marketing director for the Arkansas Development and Finance Authority [ADFA]. Larry, I'm glad you're alive and well. I've heard you on other programs. It's, I know you're a bit tentative at times, you're kind of looking out the window, because you have seen the body count rise in the last year or so. And I'm sure that there is a certain amount of circumspection here as to whether you should be as public in telling what you're telling. But isn't there also a certain amount of "insurance" and security when you do so?

LARRY NICHOLS: Well that was the decision I made in 1990. I knew that there was a good chance if I came out against Clinton that I'd be one of the "unsolved mysteries" [i.e. murdered]. And it's been part of my plan all along that as long as I maintained a certain amount of visibility, then they really couldn't afford to hurt me. And I've tried to do that.

DONAHUE: O.K. Let's talk about, if you could, uh we have some stations just joining us; may not have been with us the first hour. Give us an overview of what you think the strongest allegations are against this President, this reprobate, degenerate President, and why you believe it will force him to either be told to, or "wake up and smell the roses," if you will, that it's time for him to go back to, uh "the chicken plucking state."

NICHOLS: The list of legitimate charges grows daily. As it relates to me and my time with him, certainly the most serious is that of laundering money through a state agency of which he had to sign off [i.e. give final approval] on every bond issue, number 1. Power brokering, number 2. Uh, slush funds, you name it.

And if you took me plumb out of the picture, if you said, "O.K. Everything about you is not significant," then you have to go to what has happened since he's been President. And I think the greatest of all was the raid on Vince Foster's office by Nussbaum, his secretary, Hillary Clinton's personal secretary, and Patsy Thomasson. Now anybody would know that you do not go in and tamper with evidence.

I will tell you this, that a lady named Helen Dickey(?), who works at the White House, who was Chelsea's nanny in Arkansas, who went to Washington with them (uh, she could not get a security clearance, so they listed her as a security person), when, the day Foster died, she came into the White House and said, "Vince Foster has been shot in the parking lot, in his car."

DONAHUE: Hmmm... [surprised, pensive]

NICHOLS: Now to corroborate that statement. She called back to the Governor's office here in Arkansas. And fortunately for us, and unfortunately for her and Clinton, the person that was on duty that took the call was none other than Roger Perry. {1}.


NICHOLS: Roger Perry had to take that same message and pass it on to the Governor and his wife. Now you say, "Well, what's significant about him being shot in the parking lot versus the park?" Even if we give them the point that he may have committed suicide, the fact that he was in... on the premises of the White House would give the law authorities immediate access to his office. The fact that he was in the park, not on the premises of the White House, meant that the police could be stalled by having them to get a search warrant.

Now Nussbaum -- and Tom, I think you know, I brought it out on your program -- when we first brought it out, they said that we were lying.

DONAHUE: Yep. Um-hmm [agrees].

NICHOLS: Well then we find out they did do it.

Well then they said they took nothing from the office, from the safe. Then we found out they did. Now that is tampering with evidence in a criminal investigation. And a suicide, until it's ruled a suicide, is a criminal investigation. Law school 101 tells everybody not to tamper with evidence. That is a serious charge.

Now. Then we have the shredding of documents at the Rose Law Firm. We have... You know, I said it on your program. "They're shredding documents." Everybody called me a liar.

DONAHUE: Right. That's right.

NICHOLS: Well now we have the people that were shredding the documents. Even after Fiske told them not to even take out the garbage, the next day they were shredding documents. And are shredding them still.

DONAHUE: And at the Rose Law Firm as well.

NICHOLS: And at the Rose Law Firm. Now. How does that affect us? When Hillary Clinton had her press conference, last week or whenever, you must notice that she always said, "I don't believe that you will find anything to prove any wrongdoing." "I don't think you will find..." "I don't think you will find..."

DONAHUE: [chuckles] Those were her words. Yeah.

NICHOLS: Why didn't she just say, "No"?!

DONAHUE: She learned something from the Watergate investigation. She was an aide at that time to one of the congressmen, right?

NICHOLS: Yessir.

DONAHUE: Yeah. And so she learned that it probably does help to destroy evidence. Don't keep it around like Nixon did.

NICHOLS: That's right. And you know, it's easy for her to say, "I don't think you'll find...", when they've been shredding documents! If I'd have been shredding documents, I don't think you'd find it either!

So those are serious charges all.

DONAHUE: Let's go back to Foster. Uh, based on what you know, people you've talked to, your own investigation, is it possible it was a suicide? Or do you think the evidence is just so strong in the direction that he had to be "taken out" [i.e. murdered] for what he knew and... Tell us what you know.

NICHOLS: I can tell you this: That if it were a suicide, then it's the only one like it in the annals of forensic medicine or whatever they call that stuff. Because I've talked to tons of people: It just doesn't happen.

Then when you add to the fact that the man with the van {2}, that first found the body, has now been found... {3} You'll notice, 2 weeks ago Robert Fiske was gonna issue a report clearing the way for a [determination of] suicide. Then all of a sudden, Gordon Liddy announces the man with the van. Robert Fiske does not release that report. And the man with the van, that found the body, said he walked around the body for some 20 minutes. There was no weapon anywhere, no gun to be found. And then when you add the fact that his statement, which was, you know, that he didn't even know he was dead because there was no blood, you know, just a trickle out of his nose, a little out the side of his mouth. You see, that's consistent with the ambulance driver's story.

No. Vince Foster didn't commit suicide.

DONAHUE: What would be the motivation to "take him out"? I'm saying that naively, but there are naive people out there. Maybe you can fill in the blanks.

NICHOLS: Vince Foster probably had the greatest amount of evidence, of anybody in America, of the absolute actions of Bill and Hillary -- their illegal actions. And I think he was about to snap: from the "Travelgate," the constant microscope of the media. He had information that, if it were to get out, would destroy Clinton. And, back to the other caller about the levels, the different tiers, I think he had information that would destroy several tiers up on the power structure. And at that point, he became a liability.

Did Bill Clinton sign an order to get him killed? No. The people that profit from Bill Clinton being where he's at, they take care of their own. And I think that Mr. Foster was in a precarious situation.

DONAHUE: I wonder who this organization of thugs are that are beating up reporters. Uh, you're finding people like Jerry Parks assassinated, um slain because he knew too much. You have, um I mean this really is a criminal enterprise, and it's gone from Arkansas to the White House.

NICHOLS: That's right. And I've tried to forecast that. I've tried to promise that to the people. And now, you see, with this criminal enterprise... I believe it's a criminal group. When you think about what they're doin', they're laughin' at us because they're sayin', "Now our guys have semi-automatic weapons. The police have 9-milimeter pistols."

It's the public that's armed and the public's gettin' mad and the public's gonna stand up and stop things if the police don't. They're gonna start taking... We're gonna be forced, as American people, that take the law into their own hands to clean up our neighborhoods. Agreed?

DONAHUE: Yeah {4}.

NICHOLS: If we are sitting there with equal force to match that of the bad guys, then the bad guys got problems.

DONAHUE: It's a travesty of justice. Because I have a case goin' on that they are, they have put together a vindictive prosecution against me because of what I know and what I tell on a daily basis.

And I walk into the Department of INjustice, or Criminal INjustice, and see the pictures of Bill Clinton, and "Butcher" Reno on the walls... You want to grab those and just smash 'em to the floor and stomp on them. You're just so sickened by it, because you know those two should be in jail.

NICHOLS: Well and that's the problem that I have. (By the way, Tom, I still can't hear you very well.) The problem I have is where do you go. When you walk in the courtroom, who do you see? Sneering at you. When you try to put your faith in the justice system, who's running it? They are.

DONAHUE: That's right.

NICHOLS: In Arkansas, in '88, everybody said, "Why didn't you come on out? Why didn't you do this? Why didn't you do that?" -- Who could I have gone to?

DONAHUE: Let's talk about what you did and when you knew that there was something wrong with the Arkansas Development and Finance Authority. What actions specifically did you take? And did you succeed?

NICHOLS: I made a mistake. If I could take back 30 seconds of my life, I'd do it different. I went to Clinton and told him he was breakin' the law, and that he had to tell or I would.

And then I was roasted mercilessly for 6 months. Destroyed. Now back in those days, people didn't understand that if you bring somethin' up, you get slammed by the media to protect Clinton. So everybody in Arkansas thinks I am what they said I am. When in fact, in 1989, I proved I didn't do what they said I was doin'. Not only that, I proved they were doin' it. And like the troopers' story, when they were found out, when the judge threw out the case, that they did not commit fraud because they had no evidence, you didn't hear in the media [that] the troopers were tellin' the truth! Therefore what they're sayin' about Clinton may be true. In 1989, I thought everbody would stand up and cheer; not one piece was printed.

DONAHUE: Your mistake was telling Bill Clinton, "'Fess up," "Tell the truth." Instead it gave him time to regroup and to retaliate.

NICHOLS: That, and I think if I look at what my family has paid, and if I look at what's happened to us and what's happening to me today: can't work, can't take money from people that want to help, 'cause if I do then I'll be discredited. And it's tough to fight the most powerful system in the world.

DONAHUE: It is. I understand. Let me ask you, what did you do, what actions did you take, against then-Governor Bill Clinton?

NICHOLS: In 1990, I filed a lawsuit. I had to go in '89 and learn law myself from the law library 'cause nobody would touch it. And that lawsuit in 1990 had everything that you're hearing today, for the most part. You'll notice one major thing: Bill Clinton, as everybody now knows, controlled the courts, he controlled the judges, he controlled the lawyers. If you doubt the integrity or the significance of the evidence that I can bring forth: Why did they not allow me to go to court and squish me like a bug? Why did they quash, maneuver my case from judge to judge, seal it, dismiss it under statute of limitations for slander when it was a libel suit with 3 years statute [of limitations], seal it back up, not even tell me or anybody else that they had opened it, sealed it, and closed it?

DONAHUE: Whole lotta chicanery goin' on back there in Arkansas. There's a lot of good people, it's a wonderful state, it's a beautiful state to visit. But there's an oligarchy there and Bill Clinton was part of it.

We're gonna come back with more of Larry Nichols' story. We're gonna take your calls, I promise, at 1-800-298-8255.

(to be continued)

---------------------------<< Notes >>--------------------------- {1} Roger Perry [Parry(?)] may be one of the Arkansas state troopers.
{2} The man with the van: Reportedly the first person to discover Foster's body in Fort Marcy Park was a man driving a white van. This witness has remained anonymous for fear that something will happen to him if he goes public. As he has stated, "I don't want to end up like that guy in the park." He claims, through his advocate, G. Gordon Liddy, to have pulled into the park with the purpose of relieving himself. He went to a secluded area where he encountered Foster's corpse. This witness is emphatic that there was no gun anywhere in the vicinity when he first arrived on the scene. Furthermore, he has been interviewed by Liddy, a former FBI agent, who followed standard FBI interrogation procedure. Liddy is absolutely convinced that his witness is telling the truth and is completely credible. {3} "...the man with the van... has now been found." Liddy's (see above) witness was persuaded by Liddy to be interviewed by the FBI. However this witness still chooses to remain anonymous to the general public.
{4} "...take the law into their own hands to clean up our neighborhoods. Agreed?" No, not agreed. Yes, some of what's going on is infuriating, but like the song says, "Keep cooly cool, boy." [From "West Side Story"].

I see people supposedly on the verge of going on an armed march to Washington, DC. Then I see that John DiNardo has had a petition going around that simply asks that people sign their names so that a proper investigation of the Waco Massacre can begin. And when last I checked, John DiNardo couldn't even get 100 people just to sign their names!! So am I to believe that we can't get 100 signatures, but that thousands of armed citizens are gonna march on Washington, DC? Here's a clue for you: If the FBI, CIA, etc. are monitoring this supposed march that is supposedly going to occur, my guess is that they are laughing their asses off. At us! At our stupid posturing that we can get a real response to a call for an armed march on Washington, DC.

For all you brave people who won't sign a simple petition but will risk your lives in a march on Washington, DC: Here's something really brave you can try before your "grand march" -- public speaking. Gasp! Not that! Not public speaking! Sure, we'll pick up a gun and march to Washington, but please don't ask us to pick up a video camera, say something informative, and demand that it be played on public access television. We're gonna march and risk getting shot dead or imprisoned, but public speaking?! Gasp! Please, not that. That's too scary!

Final disclaimer: I do not support any armed march on Washington, DC. I do support that we pick up our video cameras, march to the local cable operator, and go on public access TV. Now that would take some guts.

I encourage distribution of "Conspiracy Nation."

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Aperi os tuum muto, et causis omnium filiorum qui pertranseunt. Aperi os tuum, decerne quod justum est, et judica inopem et pauperem. -- Liber Proverbiorum XXXI: 8-9

Brian Francis Redman "The Big C"

"Justice" = "Just us" = "History is written by the assassins."